The worst experience I've ever had...

DillsMommy wrote: I just had the WORST experience of my life, it was so scary. I work at an assisted living home, (called "beehive homes") taking care of elderly people. We have one lady there that, likes to shove food in her mouth when she eats and occasionally chokes a little from doing so, but nothing serious. Well, today only about 2 hours ago, they were all eating dinner and she chokes on a brussle sprout. She starts gasping for air, drooling, but was still conscience. She kept grabbing at me and looking at me like "please help." We pat her on the back, raise her arms, try everything and nothing works. I freak out and call 911, like any normal person, right? It feels like the ambulance takes FOREVER to get there. By the time they get there, she is a blue-ish grey color, no pulse, not breathing. She had passed away. I was shaking, crying, panicking, the works. They lay her down and take out the brussle sprout, and resesitate her then take her to the hospital. When her son gets there he is MAD at us for calling 911, she has a DNR ( do not resesitate) order. And he wanted us to pretty much let her choke to death, and was mad at the ambulance people for bringing her back to life. He made them bring her back to the beehive where she is now, not responding to anything, and it's only a matter of time till she passes away again. I am still shook up over it, and mad at myself for not cutting up her food smaller. And to make things worse her son and daughter-in-law are upset that she's still alive! They are just waiting for her to die so they can get her money and anything else in the will. I'm sorry, but I care about these people way too much to let them die, especially in a way like that. I've worked there since the day we opened, 3 years ago, and I think of these people like my own family.

luvmykids replied: How awful!

Even if you had known about the DNR I didn't realize they applied to any cause of death, I thought they were only for being taken off life support, etc. I would have probably called too.

Momof3inMe replied: I am sure you were doing what you thought was right and like you said you called 911 like any other normal person would do. I use to work in a daycare that was in a nursing home and I also thought a lot of the people were family.

cameragirl21 replied: Her son is not a rocket scientist, is he? A DNR means that if a person dies of natural causes (ie, heart stopping) then you don't perform CPR or defibrillate. It does NOT mean that you let a person choke to death or anything like that.
Btw, the heimlich maneuver is the thing to do in this case, wrapping your arms around the persons waist and pressing up just under the rib cage till the food dislodges.
Don't blame yourself, this is certainly not your fault in any way.
Take care,
Jennifer

luvbug00 replied: Poor lady her son is essentally killing her. Don't worry it wasn't your fault you knew her condition and you cut her food I'm sure like you have every other day and there is nothing you can do if her body couldn't handle it. Your staff and you tried your best and did what you thought was right. I think you have NOTHING to be regretful about.

kimberley replied: that is just awful. i am so sorry you and that lady had to go through that. i hope the son and his wife get theirs!

1lilpeanut2love replied: OMG! That is shocking. What is wrong with the son and daughter in law. Geez. Some people. I was almost crying reading your post. You did the right thing. IT seems like you have really gotten attached to these people. I praise you for taking care of these people. Way to Go!!!

MoonMama replied: Oh my goodness how horrible and scary!

3xsthefun replied: That poor lady. As for her son & daughter in law.

Bamamom replied: Bless your heart - I can't even imagine how you must be feeling but my thoughts are with you. I think you totally did the right thing in calling 911. I bet if you guys hadn't called then that stupid guy would be screaming about that too. Some people are just like that

Maddie&EthansMom replied: That's so sad. I really feel for that lady. I'm sorry you had to go thru that. How tragic.

JP&KJMOM replied: How awful for you. As for he son and DIL I have no nice words to say!

DillsMommy replied: Thanks everyone for the kind words. It was awful, I've never expirenced anything like that before and hope I never have to again!

PrairieMom replied: DNR does not mean don't try! Good grief! You were not wrong to call 911. I work in the medical field and see people pass away all the time. It sucks. It really takes a toll on a person after a while. Do you have debriefments afterward? sometimes getting together with other people to talk about it helps.

mckayleesmom replied: What a jerk son and daughter in law.....I hope she pays them back and they are not in the will....

amandadakota replied: THAT WOULD BE SCARY. BUT ALOT OF CHILDREN DO GET MAD WHEN THAT HAPPENS. IT'S SAD TO SAY BUT SOME OF THEM ARE WAITING FOR THEIR PARENTS TO PASS AWAY. THEY ARE EXPECTING THINGS FROM THEM LIKE INHERITANCE(SP) OR OTHER THINGS... IT'S SAD BUT IT DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT.

I WOULD SAY THAT YOU DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT THE ORDER IF THERE ARE ANY QUESTIONS.

boyohboyohboy replied: I am so sorry that happened to you. What is your job title, ws there someone there who was to be in charge in a case like that, that you were left alone to do it?
I also had a very similiar situation, I am a nurse, and work mostly in elderly/dementia wards. (before I became a SAHM)
but the same thing happened, a man choked on food, he was a DNR, and his family had made it clear that they wanted nothing done, in any case, and our residents wore bracelts of certain colors so you knew who was to get what in case of emergency. But I was in training, and the nurse just watched him, we removed him to a private area, and he choked to death.
I agree that I think she did the wrong thing, I think that DNR would only fall into play if you removed the food, and there was still no sign of life.

Its a hard situation to be in, but I totally agree with tara, the only thing that helps is if you have people at work to talk to, who go thru it with you.
Bless you for taking care of the people who need it the most.

you must have a very kind heart

amynicole21 replied: How terrible!! I'm so sorry. I would have been traumatized.

Perhaps her family can have her wear a bracelet or necklace that states she is DNR? Not that it would have mattered in this situation. If she fell in a pool, would they want you to let her drown?? Same thing in my opinion.

~Roo'sMama~ replied: How awful! And how sad that they're just waiting for her to die. I have worked in a nursing home too and I know that DNR means that if they become unconscious or something you're not supposed to do CPR, but I think you're still supposed to call 911. heck you're supposed to call 911 if someone dies. I really don't think that DNR means you should let someone choke to death on their food. I agree with Stacy that it would apply after you've done the heimlich or something to remove the food and they still weren't responding. Shame on that awful man and his wife!

PrairieMom replied: I have been thinking. Who is it that actually wanted her to be a DNR? In my expereiance it is the PATIENT that decided, usually along with the help of their families what is right fir them. Was it HER wish to be a DNR? if it was, the family is getting a lot of the blame when maybe all they were doing was looking out for their loved ones best intrest.
In my profession I have been on both sides of the road. I have seen people literally torture their loved ones to death trying to "save" them, but I have also seen people be very hasty about "pulling the plug"

It is very hard as a health care worker to stand silent on the sidelines.

Either way tho, I would have called 911 too. You can't be to careful, it could have very easily gone the other way, and the family could come after you ( the HOME) saying that you didn't try hard enough.

~Roo'sMama~ replied:
Even if it was her decision to be DNR, would that really apply to choking on food? I don't remember much about it I guess, but if it had happened to someone who was DNR while I was working at the nursing home I think I would have done the Heimlich and if they were unconscious after the food was out then it would be out of my hands.

PrairieMom replied:
I don't think so, like I said, I would have called 911 too, and I would have tried the heimlich menuver.
I DO think it applies to the actions taken my the EMT's. If she was pulseless and not breathing, they should have let her go.

holley79 replied: I thought a DNR was for when/ if someone is on life support. The doctor explained it to us that they do have to try and save your life but can not allow you to live by artifical means.

That is very scary and I'm sorry you had to go through that. I get attached very easily also so I totally understand.

mom2my2cuties replied: A DNR, applies to "Life saving measures" So what you did was fine, however the paramedics are the one who violated the DNR.

A DNR does apply to any kind of death. It is also known as Dying with Dignity. (I.e Car accidents, accidental death, cancer, etc)

I have some more information on this in my school stuff.


I would have done the same thing as you though, and wouldn't have stood in the way of the Paramedics.

PrairieMom replied:
If a paitent is a DNR we will NOT put them on life support. They don't HAVE to try to save their lives, it is the paitent or the paitent advocates choice.
When they are already on life support things are a little more difficult. Life support isn't just considered a breathing machine either. It can be tube feeings or chronic dialysis. Any medical intervention that a patient will die with out.

TheOaf66 replied: well there is a loving son huh...why did you keep my mother alive? I certainly don't want my mother to go that way. I think you did the right thing and he should be shot, sorry u had to experience that.

A&A'smommy replied: How awful!!!!

DillsMommy replied: My "title" is only a "caregiver" Because we are not a nursing home, no one has to be licensed. We are a small facility with room for only 12 residents. I've seen people pass away there before, and it's sad, but they have all been from natural causes. I guess that's why I freaked out so much was because of the way it happened. Her son wanted us to call him first, then 911. So when they got there he could have told them what to do. And also the lady can not speak, because she had a stroke several years ago, before she moved in with us. At the time she signed the DNR she could speak and that was her choice, but now that she can't her son makes it seem like she wants to die and it doesn't matter how. I stopped by work today (im off wed.) to check on her, I asked her if she was glad I called 911 and she shook her head "yes" and gave me a big hug. I feel so much better, knowing what I did was right and that she's happy to be alive.

punkeemunkee'smom replied: I am sorry you went through that ! What an (^&*&%&^$ that son is! Thanks mom for raising me now could you hurry up and pass so I can spend your money? What a JERK!

Boo&BugsMom replied:
That's what I would think too. How can someone be upset for their mother to still be alive? I can't imagine feeling like that. If it was my mom, you would have gotten a HUGE hug from me!

mom2my2cuties replied:


I remember once I was working a head injury ward, and someone actually kept getting upset that thier loved one hadn't passed yet. But it was because they had been in horrific accident (head on with a tractor trailer at 80 mph). They survived but they were more or less a vegetable.

Sometimes it is easier for some to see thier loved ones in a casket than to have to know they are going to be just suffering or a vegetable all thier life.


Personally, I'm not sure how I feel. When I was 19, my ex husband & I had been married 1 month & 1 day and we had a really bad accident, he was ejected from the vehicle and ended up in a coma for almost 2 months. (I came to work in the head injury ward because of this - was there all the time and had the training already) anyway, I remember our first night there, I was still pretty out of it as I had rolled our pick up truck and while I wasn't injured to the point he was, I was still pretty beaten up and looked horrible. I remember the doctors, nurses ect gathering around me and questioning me about life support, surgeries he would need and hearing them tell me that he probably wasn't going to make it, if he did he wouldn't be normal again etcetc...And all I am sitting there thinking is "God I need to breathe - what do I do" And then I hear myself say "Do what it takes to keep him alive" And I am so glad i did. he made a full recovery and we went on to have a have a little boy together. (We divorced because he is an ass )

Jackie012007 replied: sounds like he has power of attorney over his mother... happens a lot when people go into elder care and "can't take care of things themselves". If this woman has money, and her son has power of attorney, he may be just waiting for her to kick so that he can get $$. It's sick, and I saw it happen when I used to work in an extended care facility. No you did not violate the DNR - and if you had done the heimlich it would not be a violation either... DNR applies ONLY to CPR efforts to regain pulse or breathing. Whoever resucitates successfully is the violator and unfortunately legal action can be taken against them

mom2my2cuties replied: "Do not resuscitate" does not mean, "do not treat." A DNR order covers only one type of medical treatment CPR. Other types of treatment, including intravenous fluids, artificial nutrition and hydration, and antibiotics, must be discussed with the physician separately. In addition, although CPR will not be given to a person who has a DNR order, all measures can and should be used to keep a person comfortable.

Something I have found is that some people often confused a DNR with an Advance Directive in which the patient states his or her beliefs about breathing machines, feeding tubes, etc. (The types of treatment covered in paragraph 1 - copied from www.webmd.com)


Honestly though, there is nothing for you to worry about, as Jackie said, the only person who is legally responsible for violation of the DNR is the person who actually resuscitated her. Which is why malpractice insurance is so so so very important for anyone (no matter how miniscule your job is - if you touch a patient you need it)