children with ADHD - who take meds

boyohboyohboy wrote: The 7 yr old girl I watch is finally seeing a dr for her behavior. My understanding is that the dad was asked to have her treated by the school and school board. She completed her pretesting this week and saw the dr yesterday who made his med recommendations..she was to start them last night. Well, the girl told us that she didnt get her meds because her dad said it was her mother that was to pay for them and the mother said she had rent due and wasnt going to get them now..
so no meds..

now the school board says that more needs to be done for her and she needs to see a psycologist also..the dad says he has done enough and feels thats over kill. I absolutely dont think all her issues are due to ADHD. I agree another set of eyes on her can only help.
How ever this is my fear....I am afraid that the dr's are going to order meds, the parents might start them, but not give them as ordered, like, might not get them refilled in time, might not send them back and forth to each other like when they are trading days with the kids..and might just forget..my experience comes only from when they are antibiotics...they didnt get to the dr until they were all really really sick, and when the one girl had her antibiotics filled for strept, the dad just gave some of those to the son who he thought also had strept..and they shared the bottle instead of taking on the expense of going to the dr and getting his own..

so does anyone know of anyone on these meds and what we can expect if she only takes them periodically?
I am concerned about it messing with the chemicals in her brain and her having outbursts or getting more angry then she already does...
I have little children in the house, my concern is for safety..

mummy2girls replied: Marcus worked with a boy who had ADHD and the parents are so much like this little girl. They would forget to give the meds and then the child would be off the wall. They would send him to school with no meds in him so Marcus found him to be so hard to control. The school could only do so much in regards of the meds. They even asked the parents to just bring the meds to school to keep there and with permission for them to give the child his meds themselves. The parents decided ok and it was good from there.There can be a saftey thing but it depends on teh severity of the ADHD. My mom took care of a girl when she was a nanny who had ADHD and she seemed not to be really bad. The mom took her off the meds to see if something other than drugging the child can be done and they found other ways... when she got out of control is was mild vs what Marcus dealt with. he was hit and just was in his own little world at times and just could not sit still to save his life. He would all of a sudden stand up in class during a test because he heard a pencil drop and just go crazy running around teh class knocking things of the other kids desks. Marcus had to take him out of class and deal with him and those were one of the many time dad would show up in the middle of school and say oops i forgot to give him his meds... But keeping it at the school helped fix the problem big time!!!!

maby if they give you the meds to keep at your place so you give them to the child when needed... BUT with written permission from the doctor and parent of course. In my dayhome i cannot give a child prescription drugs unless the doctor itself signs a form and the parents as well saying i have permission. other than that there is so much anyone can do its up to the parents unfortunetly:(

lisar replied: My best friends child is on it she has been on MANY different kinds. I think most children in this case needs more attention and more discipline. And a more structured life. I don't think they need medicine to get them high to calm them down. Seeing a therapist might help the child and help her talk about why she is the way she is. ADHD to me is something that was made up by the drug company's and by therapist cause there was nothing they could do. I just don't see the point is drugging a child.
Me and my best friend argue about this all the time. I was so sick of her kid being bad, and all her mom would say is "well she didn't take her medicine this morning" That is no excuse for being a back talking little brat. I have strong feelings on this and this is one subject that me and my best friend have agreed to disagree on. And we try not to talk about it.

mummy2girls replied:
i agree for sure but there are some kids out there that really do need it. for the mild cases i say no find other ways...

Jamison'smama replied:
I find this very offensive but I will just chalk it up to a difference in opinion here. I think the statement was a very blanket statement and clearly a lack of understanding about brain chemistry. I know that there are many children who are given medication without a need and many who are not medicated that would benefit greatly. I don't know the child in this case so I will not make that judgment here but I suffered from childhood ADHD and adult ADHD as does my brother. We lived a very disciplined, structured life. My daughter is struggling with this as well but I don't share those struggles on this board because of reactions like that.

Now, to answer the question, most medications that are given for ADHD are in and out of the system within a matter of hours--usually 6-12. Unless he is on Strattera or another that builds upon itself (which are not prescribed often) taking it intermittently will not harm him but if he needs the meds, the days he is not on it will be more difficult as far as impulse control and the ability to learn. It is not like an antibiotic where you must finish a dose in order for the meds to work. They are quickly metabolized medication more like Tylenol.

lisar replied:
I understand that. But I am totally against it. I think it should be up to the parents. Which it is. To each their own. I would never give it to my child though.

lisar replied:
To each their own.


And to say I have a lack of understanding on it, well I find that offensive. I have done alot of research on it trying to find other ways for my best friend to help her child with school work without drugging her. We have found that listening to classical music on an I-pod while at school has helped. Lots of different things.

And this kind of "reaction" on this board is normal. If not from me then from someone else.

boyohboyohboy replied: so if it is given at night before she goes to bed and it wears off before she goes to school then how does it help her at school?

she is failing very badly at school..her thoughts are scattered and she cant barely maintain a conversation.
she is also very violent and mean..she says hateful things all the time and doesnt have a conscious.
she seriously reminds me of a child that will grow up to be a seriel killer.

its the look in her eyes, and the smile that just gives you chills.

she is very manipulative and very sexual when there is a male in the room..she strives for praise but when she gets it just shrugs her shoulders..

I think that psychologist might be more of a help then the drugs..but in this case she does need something..

her parents are not going to be her rock...she needs more help then just them..I really dont want to take responsibility for the meds, as there are to many little kids in my house..
we dont have a locked medication cabinet..

Jamison'smama replied: I don't know what she is prescribed so I don't know about her particular situation. Is she being treated only for ADHD or do they think it is something more along the lines of childhood bipolar disorder?

I know the many current ADHD medications that most children are prescribed are short acting (relatively) and are given in the morning and begin working within 30 min to an hour and should wear off before bedtime.

boyohboyohboy replied:
I wont find out until today what it is she is taking..but she told me that it was something she takes before bed and she thinks its to help her sleep better..she cant sleep..

I dont know what her issues are, I think there are for certain more then one. I dont know that it is ADHD but it sounded like she was seen by health care professionals that deal with it..the school set it all up and he finally took her they have been after him to do it for two years..now she is so far behind in school and also she is very difficult to deal with ..
her brother is the same way, he does the rocking and the violent outbursts.

I have a soft spot for these kids but at the same time, I dread seeing them daily.. if that makes sense.
I really wondered what the effects of sporatic medications might have on her.
I suppose the school will see that also.

Jamison'smama replied:
I apologize for offending you with the assumption that you had not researched the brain chemistry of children who may or may not have ADHD. I try very hard not to be offensive towards other people in any way.


I undertand that you shared your opinion and you have every right to it as do the rest of us. The way it was presented was hurtful to me and may have been for other families who have experienced first hand, children with adhd or brain chemistry related problems.

lisar replied:
This sounds like more than just a case of adhd to me. If she isnt sleeping, and sexual when males are around and things like that. It just sounds like more than adhd. It really does.
My best friends kid is mean to all other kids, doesnt do her school work, just flat out refuses to do it, she has a mouth on her that is so mean and hurtful, and she just flat out doesnt have any respect for anyone. She has held Lexi down so that lexi couldnt tell on her, she has locked lexi in her bedroom so she couldnt come and tell, she has flat out slapped Lexi across the face, slapped austin hits them pushes on them. And if she doesnt get her way she will pitch a tee total fit. And all her mom normally says is
"Well she didnt get her medicine today, so I dont want to get onto her and mess up her emotions" thats a copout. weather she got her medicine or not she needs to be punished. Plain and simple.
My cousin was also on it when he was little. It never helped him either. My aunt ended up putting him karate to try and help him and it worked. It was a way for him to learn to control his emotions. Which I think that is what alot of it is, is that most kids just dont know how to control their emotions. I am not saying thats the case in all of it though. But I think dr's are way to quick to diagnose a child with ADHD and drug them. KWIM?

lisar replied:
Just to add most kids that have been diagnosed with ADHD are actually VERY smart children.

And I wasnt trying to offend you or anyone else I was really just stating my opinion on it. Which apparently I am not allowed to do anymore. Seems how it was deleted

A&A'smommy replied: it sounds to me like she has a severe case of ADHD and probably needs more than medicine, like her parents coming together and working with her more and seeing a phycologist and probably putting her on a special diet.. it would take a lot but her parents have to be willing to help her.

My best friend and her brother BOTH have ADHD Ashley took meds when she was a kid and it helped her a LOT, it also helped her learn to control it (also she grew out of the worst part of it). Her brother was never on meds that I know of and I can tell he has a LOT of issues with it.

boyohboyohboy replied:
the abusive behavior you described does sound like things she does..but she also chokes her brother..she has taken sharp objects and carved her name in my furniture..she steals..she has a nasty mouth..but as soon as I get on her, I mean really yell at her, she cries and she wants me to forgive her terribly.she is so dramatic.
she says she hates her brother..and has pushed him down the stairs..recently her two yr old sister...
I think thats what I am afraid of...she is off balance in her normal state, what does giving her sporatic meds mean for her mentality..
her parents are not going to come together to do anything for her..they both love her in their own way..but its not going to get any different then it is.

Boo&BugsMom replied: I have to agree with Lisa on the issue, but I don't expect anyone to agree with me. I have seen very few cases personally (working in daycare and schools) where kids actually need it. Most times, the environment of the child plays the biggest role, IMO. I think the schools and social workers, etc. just don't want to do enough parent education about giving a child the proper living environment. Every single case I have worked with, the child came from a broken home, had no structure, no discipline or very inconsistant discipline, etc. I don't want to go as far as saying it's bad for every child (I do think there are some cases where the child really does need it), but I think our world is looking for a quick fix these days and parents are wanting to work less at being a parent. I also do not have any first hand experience with my own children being ADHD, so...I would never want to say it's not good for anyone as I can't imagine making that decision to put my child on meds, or not on meds.

As far as the meds Stacy, if they are not given consistantly they will not work one bit for what she needs it for and will only make the situation worse, IMO. Even if she misses a day, it wont do any good really and she's not going to make much progress. Just like with her discpline, structure, etc....she needs it to be CONSISTANT. Meds like these usually take a little while to work in the system. I find it hilarious when people say as soon as their child took the pill one time, it was a night and day difference. Um no...it takes awhile for the body to absorb the medication before you see the affects, normally. However, after it's in the body for awhile then the body will react faster to it and you will be able to notice the behavior change in the days she is on it, versus the days she is not. I'm not just speaking from my butt either...the doc's I work with are very knowledgable about this stuff. :-)

If she is given the medication inconsistantly, you might not see any difference. It really depends on how her body will react to it too. If she really "needs" the medicine, you will notice a complete difference in her behavior during the days she is on it. If you do not see any difference, then she really doesn't "need" it.

Jamison'smama replied: Okay, so I will share.

Jamison is medicated for ADHD. She is of the inattentive type and not hyperactive. We spent 2 years in occupational therapy to learn to work through these issues in other ways. We used sounds, resistance therapy, modulation exercises, things to do before school, during school etc. She is bright but could not stay on task long enough to complete any work. She could read and write early but was unable to stay focused on a page long enough to read it. She would write very large and her thoughts were very tangential on paper.

We changed her diet, her home life is structured very structured. She is taking classes to give her the discipline and stimulation her body craves.

We began medicating her in October of this year. The medication works in 30-40 minutes. I'm not sure what medication you are referring to Jennie but the medications that are most often prescribed begin their effectiveness within 30 minutes to an hour. It can take a couple of weeks to see the initial side effects dissipate--for Jamison is was increased emotional sensitivity. She was on Celexa but it lasted too long and she was having some insomnia, we switched to Focalin but she had too low of a dip early in the day and was to hyper focused. We then tried Adderall but the effects on her were not good. We are now using Metadate--an earlier form of Celexa that is shorter acting. Her mood is great, her personality is unchanged and she moved up 3 reading levels since October. She can get her thought on paper and has excelled in school.

The common medications do have an immediate effect. That is what makes them interesting. You should see the difference in her writing the day before and the day after medicating. I know someone on Strattera. It is a less often prescribed medication that takes 2-3 weeks to become most effective. It works best on those that run a little higher on the anxiety spectrum and was often prescribed for children when it came out initially because it is not a stimulant but was found to be less effective on the general population of ADHD kids.

I am a social worker, I spent years working with kids both in groups and as a therapist, I taught parenting classes, I know first hand some people's view on medication and maybe I somewhat shared their view before my daughter began school. But I am educated on this, I don't step into things lightly. It is not for everyone and I encourage people to research before medicating but don't discount it for everyone. A blanket statement cannot be made here.

Cece00 replied:
While I intently disagree with your stance on ADHD esp as a mother who has a son with ADHD and know its NOTHING about "being more structured" or "his environment" (esp seeing as how I have 3 children who do not have ADHD)- I agree with you that this sounds like a LOT more than ADHD with this child.

The sexual behavior alarms me. Pretty big red flag there...

The violence too.

I hope she is evaluated by someone to see what the deal with the child is, that doesnt sound @ ALL like ADHD.

And also, Lisa, I can see why you may have your views on ADHD considering your friend- her behavior doesnt sound like ADHD either.

Being mean, violent, smart-mouthed, etc are not hallmarks of ADHD. My son does none of those things, and the handful of children with ADHD I know do not do that either.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/adhd/symptom.htm

Cece00 replied:
I disagree completely with your first paragraph.

Also, depending on the meds- the very first dose DOES work, it literally CAN be day and night.

Although I do agree that consistency is the key with the meds, not bc they need to "build up" (there are certain kinds that do but the large majority are completely the opposite) but because a consistent plan combined with meds and behavior modification is best for the child. Also because any day they dont take the meds if they actually need meds, their behavior is obviously going to be drastically different and difficult to deal with.

boyohboyohboy replied: so the dad told me the dr suggested aderol?
does anyone have any experience with this drug?
she is to take it before bed..
he is already upset about the cost..as I said or think I did he doesnt cover her insurance..

Jamison'smama replied: Jamison took Adderall (the non XR version) for a very brief time---3-4 days. I didn't like the side effects for her but it is a common and less expensive medication that comes in a generic form. I don't understand taking it before bed. THe XR last about 8 hours I believe and the non XR is around 4-6. It can cause insomnia so I am surprised at the nighttime dosage but I suppose the doctor prescribed it that way for a reason. I just can't imagine.

Cece00 replied: Yeah, they need a new dr.

What they really need is a pediatric psychIATRIST and a REAL evaulation.

Adderall is a stimulant. It should not be given before bed. Furthermore, its a short acting or XR long acting, and is for 8 hrs- so either way it will wear off before it can work, which is during the day during school.

boyohboyohboy replied: I am at a loss then.
i cant really talk to the parents about this info..
I had a really hard time getting them to even tell me what drug it was.
I really dont think it matters because they are not going to give it to her..

I think that I could use some advice though as to how to get thru our 12 hour day a little easier..
If we stick to a strict structure here will that help the behavior of the two kids..I mean we pretty much do..right now she is here only 2 hours in the am and 3 hours after school but in the summer she will be here all day..
I am stricter with them, because they seem to find trouble..but we do almost everything like clock work.
they constantly break the rules...
is there a better way to structure the day with kids with ADHD then what I do? and again, I do think that she has issues that might be unrelated to ADHD, if that is even truely what is wrong.
she is very manipulative and lies constantly..so its hard to really get a feel for what is going on with her, her story changes in a second..

redchief replied: I know the sweetest young lady, now an adult, who would not have been able to graduate from school had it not been for her ADHD medications. She still takes her medicine everyday to enable her to focus and work. She has forgotten her medication in my presence and people can argue that these kids don't need medication but I'll tell you what I observe. This young lady needs her medicine. Without it she can not function.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
Like I said, this is coming from my personal experience...and I never said that children all together should not be on medication which it seems like you are reading into my statement that way...read my whole statement please. Your child is probably one that does need it, and as his mother I'm sure you can attest to that...however, just because your own child needs it doesn't mean the millions of other children that are on it do need it....that is my point. The children that I have PERSONALLY worked with are not like the cases that you or Jamison's mama are talking about. I don't see how you can completely disagree with my first paragraph when I said nothing that contradicts what you have said in that paragraph.

About the meds "kicking in"...the experiences that I have had were quite a few years ago (about 6-8) since I no longer teach. It is very possible that the meds work quite differently now these days than they did back when I taught. Meds have come a long way, even in recent years. I'm sorry if my statement about laughing at the night and day experience was hurtful, but in my past experiences, meds just weren't like that. But like I said, things change rapidly in the medical community.

ETA: the doctors I work with mainly deal with antipsychotic meds...perhaps those take awhile longer to build in the system and there is a difference between those and the ADHD meds. That is all I can think of.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
I see the same thing with some of our Clozeral (sp?) patients we deal with at work. I do think that it helps many, many people (that is why I can't argue that they are not needed, because for quite a few, they are needed)....but I also think some people abuse it and give meds a bad name for the people who really do need them. JMO though.

MommyToAshley replied: Thank you Brenda for sharing yours and Jamison's experience. I found this thread to be educational and I've actually changed some of my thoughts on the subject. I tend to agree with both sides actually -- I think our society is too quick to medicate in many cases but I also believe that there are some children that greatly benefit from the medication. I don't have a child with ADHD, so it would be hard to say what I would do. However, I think I would definitely want to do my homework. Just like there are some that are too quick to medicate, there are also those that resist that their child may benefit from medication. I know of someone that I think would benefit from the medication but I have never said anything because the parents have specifically stated they would not medicate. I am sure it is not an easy step to take, and as Brenda said, I would not enter into it lightly. It's a tough situation to be in but it's good to hear about the success stories like Jamison. Brenda, I admire you for your determination to do what is right for your daughter.

As for babysitting, I don't think I could be responsible for a child in which their parents were not following doctor's recommendations, especially in this case. I feel badly for the child, but it sounds like she needs more help that what you can offer at this time. This may sound aweful, because the girl needs stability, but based on the behaviors you've described, I am not sure I would be willing to put my family at risk.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
ITA with all of the above.

And Brenda, thank you for sharing your story as well. It is nice to hear a story about a child that has been greatly helped by a med who also has a loving and stable family and environment. It's draining to hear and see stories about kids who are on them whose behaviors probably stem from elsewhere. It's nice to hear about kids like Jamison, who really do need them and benefit from them.

boyohboyohboy replied:
my dh and I go back and forth with this all the time..when we have good days, which are not that many, we think we can handle it and that we are a constant in their lives and we allow them to see how a complete family functions. we treat them like they are part of our family.
but on the bad days, which are a lot, we think that its way to much to handle, and that our kids are being exposed to behaviors that we dont want them to mimick. I mean with a 3yr old and one yr old my kids are like sponges..I have to ask the boy to stop his "rocking" because I saw andrew doing it once..I dont want him to do that just out of habit.
I try to talk to them about what goes on at home, but most of the time the girl lies so much I dont know what to think. I have seen issues that are well in my opinion abuse, I dont think its something anyone is going to do anything about..I think this dad is way over whelmed. I think the TWO mothers are in need of some help themselves and are in no position to help these kids. I would hope that they dont have anymore, however they are all in relationships that are not healthy and they are not cautious people by the way they talk..
I do know that at some point we will have to let them go, but for now we hope to leave some mark on them for when they are older to bennefit from.

Cece00 replied:
Specifically, I disagree with this

>>Most times, the environment of the child plays the biggest role, IMO. I think the schools and social workers, etc. just don't want to do enough parent education about giving a child the proper living environment. Every single case I have worked with, the child came from a broken home, had no structure, no discipline or very inconsistant discipline, etc. I don't want to go as far as saying it's bad for every child (I do think there are some cases where the child really does need it), but I think our world is looking for a quick fix these days and parents are wanting to work less at being a parent.

Its a pretty big slap in the face to parents of kids with ADHD to suggest its the "living environment" or bc of a "broken home/no struvture home" etc etc etc

I absolutely believe some people put their kids on medication when they dont need it and that is the fault of the parent and the Dr. But its not the majority.

Perhaps that sort of behavior (parents who dont want to parent) is prevalent where you live, but its just not like that where I live.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
Like I said...it's from MY experiences and that is what I was talking about...MY experiences. I don't know why you don't get that. If you want to take it as a slap in the face, then so be it then. You are sticking to that comment and not even taking into consideration the other things I have said. I can talk til I'm blue in the face to get you to see my point, but I don't think it's going to do any good. I'm just going to agree to disagree and let it be.

boyohboyohboy replied: I am a little concerned because from what I have read about the adderal xr last night says it should only be given for a 3-4 week period..
I havent heard of his intention to take her back at all, and she hasnt started the meds yet that I am aware of..I am going to print what I found and give it to him monday..

jcc64 replied: I think it's always a good thing to walk a mile in another's shoes before judging, and to refrain from making broad, sweeping generalizations based solely on limited personal experience. Watching someone else's kids, for however long, is simply not comparable to parenting a child with a neurochemical disorder. It's very, very difficult to watch your own child not only struggle but to be subjected to judgments and prejudices similar to those expressed here. No parent wants to hear that her child's disorder stems from a dysfunctional home environment or a lack of discipline, especially when it's completely unwarranted. I'm sure there are children who are misdiagnosed, and drs and parents who are too quick on the draw with the prescription pad. Everyone here is certainly entitled to an opinion, but it would behoove us all to remember that there are people, our friends, on the receiving end of those opinions. I think a little sensitivity goes a long way in discussions like these, and that's all I'm going to say, except to say thank you to Brenda and some of the others for their candor in trying to enlighten us through their own children's experiences.

Hillbilly Housewife replied: I get that some of you have experiences with kids that seem to have a bigger issue than ADHD and are being medicated for ADHD when really it should be about something else...

There is NO DOUBT in my mind that children who are violent or overly sexual at a young age, are so due to environmental reasons. Children learn what they live. Period. In those cases, the children that are diagnosed ADHD, could have been diagnosed because there wasn't a deep enough investigation about the environment the child lives in or has been exposed to. That said - children who are raised in a loving home, with structure, proper discipline, who are put on medication for ADHD, are most likely to be the TRUE sufferers of the condition, and if/when they are put on meds, I truly believe that they may help.

Children who are left in an unruly household and given sporadic meds will have no other option but to be messed up.. because especially adhd, the child needs structure. Needs routine, to feel safe. When there's no routine.. there's no safety.. and the child will do ANYTHING to get the "It's ok, I still love you" from someone who is consistent in their life. Why else would they do bad things, knowing full well that they will get in trouble for it.. and THAT is when they get what they want.. when they beg for forgiveness and are comforted. They crave that comfort... and will most often be the most unruly with the person or people that are most present in their day to day life. They NEED to feel safe.. and the easiet was to feel safe, fr a child, is with reassurance that all is well in their world. The break something.. they apologize.. and they get comforted. Life moves on until they need it again.

You all know that I'm pretty much against all meds.. I'm all natural here, as much as possible. It does not mean that I wouldn't give my child something if they truly need it.. heck I won't even give them cold medecine, unless they're seriously suffering. It's chemical.. and they get enough chemical crap from the preservatives etc in foods we buy, but that's a whole other post.. so no, they have to suck it up, and they have to take care of themselves. Good food, plenty of fluids, plenty of rest.. and with all that, then if they're really in a state where it's too rough on them, yes, i will give them medication for it. I need to sleep too!!

I don't see how meds cannot be the best thing for them, if they are properly medicated for the proper condition. It's not really any different for children with ADHD to take something for it, than it is for a woman who has post-partum depression. I was in denial about it.. and when I finally talked to my doctor, he prescribed Effexor XR. It took me a week to even take the first pill...but once I did, my kids and my ex were quick to notice a difference in my attitude. Would I have taken the stuff if I wasn't depressed? HECK NO! Just like I wouldn't give meds to my child with ADHD (I don't have one, but if I did..) without having exhausted all other possibilities. Which I'm sure the parents HERE who have a child on medication have done... why would ANYONE put their kids on medication without having researched it, and considered and tried all other options to help their child with his/her struggles?

Maybe I'm assuming too much here.. but I don't think that any parent here would give their child heavy duty meds wjust on blind faith from the doctor's prescription.. because, exactly, the doctors can be quick to diagnose a child with ADHD even if that's not the real issue. It is far more likely that the parents of those kids on meds for ADHD for whom the meds didn't work.. weren't exactly model parents.. because the model parents I know put their time and energy into helping their child find a long term solution to dealing/coping with the struggles of ADHD before putting them on a short term pill-form solution.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
I don't know if this was aimed at me but want to clarify that my experience is not "limited" to just "watching children"! I agree it's not the same as parenting a child with the disorder, but want to add that my experience also comes from working in a SCHOOL system.

Boo&BugsMom replied:
I once worked for a lady, many years ago, who had two children will ADHD (so she said). She also pushed the doctor to get her 4 year old medicated "just in case" even though the child was actually fine. The doctor gave her the script. THIS is the type of example that outrages me.

jcc64 replied: I work in a school system as well, in a special ed classroom, specifically. My comment wasn't aimed at you, but intended more as a general comment. Working with very low-functioning kids all day long is in no way comparable to being the parent of one. Yes, it gives you some insights, but in the end, it's a limited perspective, because how a child acts out of the home is often very different than how he acts in a structured environment with different stimuli like school or daycare.
And again, I'm sure we all have stories at our fingertips of people who reach for the pill bottle rather than the much tougher behavioral approaches. However, just because some, many actually, people use antibiotics incorrectly doesn't mean other people don't have legitimate infections that require this life-saving remedy. It's no different with mental health, and that's all I was trying to say.

coasterqueen replied: Brenda,

Thank you very much for sharing your experience with Jamison. I know how hard that is for you to share and I commend you for your bravery to do so.

I only know about ADHD by what I've read (somewhat limited) and what I've seen/heard from a co-worker whose daugther has it, much like yours Brenda.

I think this is the difference for me. YOU have done so much and searched every avenue with your daughter before going onto medication. You've tried every unconventional way before going the most common way. To me that is where the difference is. My co-worker never tried ANYTHING with her DD - she went straight to the meds and her daughter still struggled. Heck, her mother is still correcting her homework assignments in college. And every time I talk to her about it she'll say "Well she just has a difficult time and she'll never get anywhere if I don't help". Can I say enabler? Anyways, I got off track there.

I researched ADHD with Kylie because she is a very hyper child on every account. So far her teachers haven't said that her hyperness has caused any problems, but I wanted to be armed with knowledge in case they ever did come to me with that diagnosis. One of the reasons why is everything I've read stated that people are quick to put children on the drugs and a lot of times a child is diagnosed with ADHD who really shouldn't. From all of my research, my understanding is that the ONLY way to ACCURATELY diagnose ADHD is a type of brain wave test (can't remember the specific name) and that no parent should accept the diagnosis until that test has been done. So I told myself if I was ever told Kylie was ADHD then she'd have the test done before I'd believe it and go further with treatment.

I believe this is why a lot of people, including myself in the past are quick to judge about ADHD, because I truly believe a lot of people are misdiagnosed and that is a very sad thing to me. I am not saying your DD was, because you are a very intelligent person and I don't believe you entered into any of this without caution on every count. I think I'm just saying why some (not me anymore, lol) may feel so strongly against ADHD.

I remember my best friend's brother who was diagnosed with ADHD. Boy, he was an extremely hyper child and the only time he was not hyper was when he was on his meds. The problem is those meds made he look so drugged, you couldn't even tell who he really was. He was miserable on them, too, you could tell. I often wonder if the drugs they gave "back then" were much more powerful and did more "damage" than they are today. Obviously we have made great strides in the medical field in general, so I feel maybe they are much better than they were and people who are so against it only remember how they were, kwim?

I look at my niece who is on OCD meds and it's horrible. The side effects she has on them is just terrible. At Christmas time she was puking 8 hours straight (every half hour) because they had just upped her dosage and her body just couldn't handle it. At that time it made me have a terrible opinion of my SIL and BIL and how they could put her on those meds. I think it's things like that, that make people feel the way they do, kwim?

Anyways, I've been rambling for nothing, I guess. lol. I know how it is to have a child with something that no one seems to understand and are quick to judge you on it. I get "well Megan doesn't have sensory issues. You just need to be this type of parent with her, or that type, etc, etc" or they say "she doesn't look like she has issues to me, she looks like a normal 3 year old who tantrums". It's a horrible feeling when people say those things because they have no clue at all how hard we've tried to do everything possible for her and many make you feel like you are pulling a diagnosis out of the sky, especially one not commonly known, or one that has a bad wrap.



BTW, to the OP, I'm sorry I didn't really respond to your OP, I was just very moved by Brenda's posts and wanted to reply.

jcc64 replied:

Fwi--teachers and school districts cannot BY LAW suggest a medical diagnosis such as ADHD. They can suggest a referral to a dr or a psych eval, but if a teacher suggests ADHD, they are on legal thin ice. The law was enacted to prevent teachers seeking a classroom of complacent children from influencing parents to drug their kids unnecessarily. I'm really not sure if it's a state-by-state or a federal thing, my guess would be it's a state law.

coasterqueen replied:
Well of course they aren't going to be the ones to put your child on drugs, but they are the ones to quickly suggest something is wrong and doctors often misdiagnose it because they don't go through the testing they should. And it may be state law here, I don't really know, but I know it was commonly practiced when I was in school.

mummy2girls replied: [QUOTE=jcc64,Feb 8 2009, 12:25 PM] Working with very low-functioning kids all day long is in no way comparable to being the parent of one. Yes, it gives you some insights, but in the end, it's a limited perspective, because how a child acts out of the home is often very different than how he acts in a structured environment with different stimuli like school or daycare.

i totally agree. marcus deals with kids with ADHD and Downs and Autism on a daily basis and he hears horror stories of how they are at home but once in school in a structures environment its such a diff story. And in some cases it can be reversed:(

Jamison'smama replied: Karen,
You are right, we tried all the things we knew to try with Jamison. Both my brother and I were ADHD as a child ---he was full blown hyperactive and I tested borderline. The medication was too harsh for me back then and thats probably what you saw as well. They took me off because the side effects were awful and so my parents tried the all natural approach--no sugar or preservatives.


I have heard of the brain test however we did not go that route. We had her tested through all the coventional means. There are several standardized tests as well as meeting the criteria of the DSM. The interesting thing about going on medication is that you can really know right away if the medication is effective. It was a lightswitch for us but we were prepared to cease the meds if not and seek yet another route (for us it was vision therapy). It was hard to stop the alternatives and ask for the one thing I was hoping to avoid but I did it for her.

Our school system did the opposite for Jamison. They never suggested anything and gave great excuses for her lack of focus (young, busy enviromnent etc.) I had to do what I belived was in her best interest and they now see what I could see and support this diagnosis 100 percent.

coasterqueen replied:
Jamison will thank you one day for all you've done for her. I know all too well about how hard it is to stop one approach and have to go with the one you fought so hard not to do. I am so glad it was a "light switch" and that things are better for her. That is great news.

Cece00 replied:
This is exactly what I was trying to say with my posts.

Thanks!